Former Attorney General William Barr told CNN Wednesday he has “come to believe” that former President Donald Trump was aware that he rightfully lost the 2020 election and there was no widespread fraud, undercutting the ex-president’s anticipated legal defense as Trump prepares to be arraigned on federal charges for trying to overturn the election.
Then-Attorney General William Barr and then-President Donald Trump attend a signing ceremony at the ... [+]
Barr, who was Trump’s attorney general after the election until he resigned after publicly stating there was no widespread voter fraud, told CNN’s Kaitlan Collins that while “At first I wasn’t sure … I have come to believe [Trump] knew well he had lost the election.”
“Everyone was telling [Trump] that the election was not stolen by fraud,” Barr told CNN, echoing the indictment against Trump, which alleges senior DOJ officials like Barr were among those telling Trump his fraud claims were false.
Barr said he was persuaded to believe Trump knew the fraud claims were false given that allies like Steve Bannon and Roger Stone said ahead of the election they planned to claim fraud if Trump lost, and the ex-president’s “lack of curiosity as to what the facts are.”
The former AG dismissed Trump lawyer John Lauro’s claims that Trump’s attempts to subvert the election results were First Amendment-protected speech as not being a “valid argument,” noting that “all fraud involves speech” and while Trump can “say whatever he wants,” including lying about election fraud, “that does not protect you from entering into a conspiracy.”
Barr also shot down claims by Trump allies that the then-president was just acting on the advice of his attorney John Eastman, arguing that Eastman wasn’t really giving advice so much as throwing out arguments and noting the situation was “unclear,” and Barr said Trump “wouldn’t listen” to most of his attorneys or his campaign, but rather would “search for a lawyer who would give him the advice he wanted.”
Barr also predicted Trump’s legal team wouldn’t actually move forward with the defense that Trump was relying on his counsel, because that would involve Trump having to take the stand and testify that in court, and the former AG believes Trump testifying “would not come out very well for him” because he would be cross-examined and Barr “doubt[s]
” Trump “remembers all the different version of events he’s given over the years.”Trump “has this penchant for engaging in these reckless acts that create these calamitous situations, and then undercut the cause he is supposed to be leading, and this is a perfect example of it,” Barr said, arguing the ex-president brought on his legal troubles himself.
While Barr has said he would not support Trump in the GOP’s 2024 primary, the AG still wouldn’t rule out voting for him in a general election. “I will have to wait to see what the situation is and I will pick my poison at that point,” Barr said.
Barr suggested DOJ special counsel Jack Smith, who led the January 6 investigation, likely has more evidence of Trump knowing his election fraud claims were false than the indictment let on. “We’re only seeing the tip of the iceberg on this,” Barr told CNN. “I think there is a lot more to come, and I think they have a lot more evidence as to President Trump’s state of mind.”
Trump “had every right to advocate for a position that he believed in and his supporters believed in,” Trump’s attorney Lauro told NPR Wednesday, adding, “What we will argue to the jury, and we'll win, is that President Trump was arguing for the truth to come out in that election cycle rather than the truth to be denied.” Trump has denied the charges against him and continued to claim there was widespread election fraud in the 2020 election, which there is no credible evidence to support.
Trump is scheduled to be arraigned Thursday afternoon in Washington, D.C., where he’s expected to plead not guilty to the charges against him. Prosecutors have charged Trump with four federal crimes of conspiracy to defraud the U.S., obstruction of an official proceeding, conspiracy to obstruct an official proceeding and conspiracy against rights, all of which could result in prison time if he’s convicted. It’s still unclear when Trump’s trial will take place and if it could be before or after the 2024 election.
Trump was indicted Tuesday by DOJ prosecutors following a years-long investigation into the January 6 attack and the events leading up to it. The indictment alleges Trump and his co-conspirators—who have not yet been charged—committed a conspiracy to “impair, obstruct and defeat the federal government function through dishonesty, fraud and deceit” in their efforts to overturn the election, through schemes like pressuring state officials, engaging “fake electors” to submit false slates of electors to Congress claiming Trump won and pressuring then-Vice President Mike Pence to block Congress from certifying the vote count. Barr stepped down as Trump’s attorney general in December 2020, weeks after the AG said publicly there was no evidence of widespread fraud. The former AG was frequently criticized while in office for doing Trump’s political bidding, but since leaving the administration has become highly critical of his former boss.
Barr says he believes Trump ‘knew well he lost the election’ (CNN)
Trump Indicted: Here’s How DOJ Says He Illegally Tried To Overturn The 2020 Election (Forbes)
Trump Indicted In Jan. 6 Probe—Here’s What Happens Next (Forbes)